Me [26 M] and my girlfriend [24 F] of 3 months had a disagreement about her choice of clothing around my male roommate. Am I being sexist? (self.relationships)

{relationships}

62 ups - 29 downs = 33 votes

My girlfriend, a hyper-intelligent and vocal feminist, and me got into a spat this morning. It began after we woke up and made our way into the living room of my apartment. She was wearing her boy short panties and, after I told her they made her ass look nice, I reluctantly told her that it made uncomfortable for her to be wearing so little in the potential presence of my roommate.

She complains that I was expecting her to compromise her comfort for my sake. I anticipated this and mostly just said I'm sorry, I really didn't think her wearing something else was such a concession to make. It didn't seem like she would be any less comfortable wearing a pair of my shorts or sweats.

Anyway, my roommate comes downstairs (right on cue) in his boxers. She points to him and incredulously asks if I'm going to tell him to put on pants. I can already sense the futility of this argument, but she demands an answer.

I tell her that 1) His boxers aren't form-fitting, aside from seeing some leg, there's still plenty left to the imagination. 2) He isn't my partner. Is it really that wrong to be covetous of your partner and want them to be more clothed in front of a roommate in that situation?

She then objected to the whole situation as an example of gender inequality. Maybe she's right. I dunno. Thoughts?

tl;dr: My girlfriend felt comfortable wearing her underwear around my roommate, but I didn't.

117 comments submitted at 21:41:13 on Jan 17, 2014 by amisexist_throwaway

  • [-]
  • armchair_anger
  • 139 Points
  • 22:04:57, 17 January

Well, the problem is that you're arguing two separate points, really.

You're saying that you believe it's inappropriate to wear only underwear around your roommate, which is a fair point of view to have!

You're then saying that it's okay for your roommate to wear only your underwear around your girlfriend, since you aren't dating your roommate.

Either wearing only underwear around other people is inappropriate (in which case you should say "hey bro, can you put pants on when you're hanging out with us?") or it's only inappropriate when it's your girlfriend, which while I can understand where you're coming from, is honestly coming off as pretty possessive if you're simultaneously okay with your roommate running around in his boxers.

It boils down to saying "Wearing only underwear is okay for him, but not for you" when you reduce it to the most basic elements.

  • [-]
  • Voiles
  • 45 Points
  • 22:47:59, 17 January

I totally disagree. Boy shorts are absolutely more revealing than boxers.

I'm pretty sure if his roommate walked in wearing boy shorts or similarly revealing underwear, OP would be like, "Dude, leave something to the imagination!"

  • [-]
  • amisexist_throwaway
  • 13 Points
  • 22:17:06, 17 January

I may have left this out, but I would discourage him from wearing his underwear too. However, I'm also wondering if my assertion that boxers ≠boy shorts holds any water? If he were wearing briefs or boxer-briefs I think it would be totally objectionable.

  • [-]
  • armchair_anger
  • 94 Points
  • 22:38:19, 17 January

I think that the biggest problem with the boxers ≠ boy shorts argument is that you're turning a distinct boundary into something unclear and full of shades of grey.

Again, trying to reduce this to the most basic level, "his underwear is okay because it's not as revealing" just opens up another can of worms. What is "too revealing"? Who gets to decide what's "too revealing"?

I suspect this is actually a source of why she takes such a strong objection to your argument, because you're basically saying "well some underwear is okay but I get to decide what's inappropriate and not", and setting specific terms on how much of her body she's allowed to reveal, rather than trying to establish general boundaries.

There's a big difference between "I'm not comfortable with you wearing just your underwear around other people" and "I'm not comfortable with form-fitting boy shorts, thongs, or this one specific pair, but I suppose that boxers or oversized boy shorts are acceptable".

By turning it from a general boundary into a varied and arbitrary list of things that are and aren't okay, you're unintentionally establishing yourself as a gatekeeper of what she is and isn't allowed to wear around your roommate, which is entirely different than saying "X makes me uncomfortable".

And think about the conclusion of this argument if it were actually carried out in real life, would you have to preview each pair of her underwear to establish whether or not it's roommate-acceptable? Would you establish a way to grade how revealing each type of underwear is?

This is all pretty much useless to think about in detail, since I really doubt that you'd ever actually go through with that scenario in real life, but what I'm really trying to get across is that there's a huge difference in "This situation makes me uncomfortable" and "I get to decide what is and isn't okay".

The argument of "boxers ≠ boy shorts" is also another way of arguing that your roommate is allowed to do things that your girlfriend isn't, in the context of your initial argument.

  • [-]
  • midwestwatcher
  • -2 Points
  • 05:36:08, 18 January

I agree making a list of arbitrary things is unfair and problematic to the relationship, but I wonder how arbitrary it is. Let me ask this question: what if it had been the roommate who had asked her to put pants on?

It seems to me that if OP and his roommate are the renters of the apartment, then the roommate has some sort of liberty to walk around his own apartment in his underwear (I would hope he would listen to OP when asked to put clothes on, but that is beside the point). Since OP's girlfriend is in their apartment, could OP's roommate ask her to put clothes on when in their home?

Basically, what I'm asking here is does it matter that OP's roommate is being asked to modify his clothing behavior in his own home (somewhere he has to be), whereas OP's girlfriend might be asked to modify her clothing behavior in someone else's home (somewhere she doesn't have to be)? Is this still arbitrary? I'm not sure, just wondering out loud.

  • [-]
  • m1m
  • 43 Points
  • 23:23:08, 17 January

I'm curious to know why this situation concerns you or discomforts you so much, especially since you don't mind your roommate being fairly unclothed in front of your gf.

My dick sometimes peeks out or falls out of my boxers. I wear boxers around my roommate and his gf.

His gf (and him) are similarly unclothed around me. We've come to terms with the fact that since we spend so much time together I various states of dress and undress, our clothing (or lack thereof) doesn't matter.

You are being pretty arbitrary in your demands I feel. Yor roommates dick could pop out of the pee hole in his boxers. And frankly, arguing boy shorts vs boxers is pretty senseless - both are basically underwear.

Your gf is not saying she wants to prance around in lingerie (or overtly sexual clothing). Just wants to be comfortable!

Let it go man. She's not being an activist, she's just not comfortable with you dictating what she does when it's clearly not wrong.

  • [-]
  • midwestwatcher
  • -3 Points
  • 01:51:06, 18 January

I think this post misses some key points to the situation. OP is not comfortable with his roommate doing it either, but if he is on the lease, there is nothing OP can do besides talk to him again. When asking if there is a double standard, we should be asking what OP is wearing, not his roommate.

Further, I think we can take it as a given that women's underwear was designed by men and has always been designed as more revealing. If there is sexism in this situation, it is in the underwear itself.

Finally, I don't like the way OP's girlfriend responded to him. OP didn't make a demand, he asked her a favor, and she responded by confronting him and shaming him in front of his roommate; that conversation should have been held in private.

All things considered, I feel like OP handled himself appropriately and OP's girlfriend responded poorly to the situation, her right to be unclothed aside.

  • [-]
  • Mephistia
  • 4 Points
  • 06:26:25, 18 January

what about if she were wearing boxers?

  • [-]
  • picklejuicebox
  • 54 Points
  • 21:49:49, 17 January

I think it's possible she may fear that this will extend to other things- are bathing suits okay? That's more revealing. Are low-cut shirts okay? Tight, short dresses? Is there something about context that changes what's okay? Why?

  • [-]
  • Gibonius
  • 5 Points
  • 01:46:26, 18 January

There are pretty standard social acceptability levels for those things. Underwear (or lingerie) is generally not acceptable for public consumption. The other things are. It's sort of absurd that you can wear a skin tight bikini in public but not underwear, but those are the commonly accepted rules of society and the connotations are different whether it makes sense or not.

  • [-]
  • amisexist_throwaway
  • 6 Points
  • 21:54:41, 17 January

A fair point. However, I should add that she has worn low-cut shirts before. The bathing suit situation did occur to me and I'm absolutely fine with that.

I do hold myself to a similar standard, aside from occasionally being shirtless in the presence of my roommate. I always put on gym shorts or sweats.

  • [-]
  • lyncati
  • 53 Points
  • 22:18:24, 17 January

You have the right to feel uncomfortable with this situation. However, she has the right to wear whatever she wants. So either you're going to have to get over it, or you two need to talk and try to come to a compromise.

Also if you are fine with a bathing suit then what's the difference honestly? A bathing suit is basically underwear that's made for the water.

  • [-]
  • Pzychotix
  • 18 Points
  • 23:26:48, 17 January

There's a time and place for everything.

I don't mind seeing other guys in speedos at the pool.

Roommate wearing nothing but briefs around the house? Uh... That's a little uncomfortable.

  • [-]
  • lyncati
  • 12 Points
  • 03:35:44, 18 January

Well then the issue isn't the dress, it's courtesy to whoever is uncomfortable in the situation.

I believe the problem here is where op states his problem stems from her being his girlfriend. I'd be comlpetely fine if he was like "hey we just don't wear our underwear in this house if you are a guest", but he didn't say that. His problem stems from her being the gf which hints at more insecurity then anything. She can wear whatever she wants when it boils down to everything and if I was told I couldn't wear something because I am someone's so and not because it's just not courteous in the apartment, I'd def have a problem with it too.

I personally am not comfortable with people wearing like no clothing around me unless it's a setting that warrants it... but you'll never see me telling someone what they can and cannot wear when they are free to choose for themselves.

  • [-]
  • midwestwatcher
  • -9 Points
  • 01:54:08, 18 January

However, she has the right to wear whatever she wants.

Well, that depends if she is on the lease. It's not her apartment is it? Theoretically, OP's roommate could object to the girlfriend's state of undress and kick her out......but I think we all know that isn't going to happen.

  • [-]
  • lyncati
  • 5 Points
  • 03:30:24, 18 January

Yeah that could happen.

I'm just saying she can wear whatever she wants... if she wanted to she could walk in public like that if she pleases... I've def seen women wear a lot less in public.

  • [-]
  • aerin_sol
  • 20 Points
  • 23:35:12, 17 January

If you're fine with a bathing suit... what's the difference?

  • [-]
  • blackberrycat
  • 16 Points
  • 00:51:56, 18 January

Well, you can share your feelings.

"Hey Amanda, it makes me feel uncomfortable when you're in your underwear around other guys."

But you can't tell her what to wear.

"Hey Amanda, will you go and put some pants on please?"

Because hey, if Amanda feels comfortable sitting around in her panties, that's just fine. Its her body. You have no say in what she does with it. She may choose to put on pants out of sensitivity to your feelings - or she may not. The only thing you can do is express yourself; if you're not happy with how she reacts, leave.

Personally I have no problem being in a bikini (or anything similarly revealing) around people I trust. If my bf told me to get dressed, I'd probably be pissed off too. He can wear a burka all day, but I'm going to dress my own body the way I want to.

  • [-]
  • midwestwatcher
  • -6 Points
  • 02:07:13, 18 January

This is a good post, but omits the fact that OP's girlfriend is a legal stranger to OP and his roommate. You can't just go into someone's apartment and disrobe. In this case, she probably won't be kicked out because OP wants the relationship to work and OP's roommate enjoys the show......but is that really the reason she should be able to be in her panties?

You can do what you like with your body in your own home.

  • [-]
  • somniopus
  • 7 Points
  • 05:00:40, 18 January

Is "legal stranger" a technical term, or are you talking out of your behind?

  • [-]
  • midwestwatcher
  • 0 Points
  • 05:19:05, 18 January

Neither. It's important to consider that she is not 'at home'. The apartment belongs to OP and his roommate. If the roommate were uncomfortable with her state of undress, he could kick her out. That he doesn't kick her out means the sole reason she is able to sit around in this apartment in her underwear is that the roommate enjoys the show.

In my view, it matters who is on the lease. Not everyone has an equal say in who goes unclothed in an apartment, especially if you don't pay any rent there. For the roommate, they are asking him to make a behavioral change about the way he lives at home. For the girlfriend, OP is asking she makes a behavioral change when she is at someone else's home.

To be clear, I'd prefer a more gender-neutral world where no one would be offended or uncomfortable by unclothed people, but I also have tremendous respect for someone's home and what they want to happen within.

  • [-]
  • somniopus
  • 2 Points
  • 05:34:57, 18 January

I'm not defending her, for crying out loud. I just have no idea what you mean by "legal stranger", since I'm pretty sure you just made that term up wholecloth.

If OP has a problem with his girlfriend's refusal to change her behavior, OP will have to decide what to do. Personally, I think I agree most with the people who are pointing out OP's glaring double-standard; I'm not sure that it's "sexist" per se, but girlfriend is not hurting anyone by wearing her underwear into a common area after sleeping over (presumably having thus been invited by OP; there's houseguests, and then there's having your SO overnight -- not quite the same level of intimacy happening, there...unless you've got some great house guests).

  • [-]
  • hopt
  • 19 Points
  • 21:52:09, 17 January

I think the main difference is she is a guest in your home and he is a resident. So he can do what he wants (within limits, of course).

I guess, what is your actual issue with the situation? Being honest with yourself, what bugs you about it? I'm definitely not saying you are in the wrong but it may help clarify to yourself (and then to your girlfriend) reasons why she should stop.

  • [-]
  • k1ssy_fac3
  • 55 Points
  • 21:46:26, 17 January

Call me old fashioned, but I wouldn't be comfortable wearing just underwear around any ~~male~~ person that wasn't my SO.

  • [-]
  • amisexist_throwaway
  • 10 Points
  • 21:48:26, 17 January

Me too. Now humor me and suppose that you did feel comfortable in your underwear in this situation. Am I being oppressive/shitty?

  • [-]
  • AyeAyeCaptain
  • 39 Points
  • 22:05:44, 17 January

I'm comfortable in my underwear however I am aware of what is and isn't appropriate. I would not wear only underwear in front of other men because it is considered intimate wear and intimacy is reserved for my husband. While bath suits cover just the same amount of flesh, bath suits are for swimming and people associate it as such.

  • [-]
  • k1ssy_fac3
  • 8 Points
  • 21:56:26, 17 January

I don't know if I would go so far as to say you're being shitty, all you did was let her know that it made you uncomfortable, but it is a bit of a blurry line... Bathing suits often times cover less than boy shorts. Would you be OK with her wearing a bathing suit around your roommate?

  • [-]
  • Honeeblood
  • 13 Points
  • 22:37:04, 17 January

I, personally, think the bathing suit argument is only relevant within the appropriate context.

I think it's two questions: 1) would you be comfortable with her wearing bikini around the house, to make dinner/sit on the couch and chat? 2) Would you be comfortable with her wearing a bikini to chill on the beach?

Does that make sense? I'm not trying to be grumpy, I just see the bathing suit argument all the time, and I do think that context is relevant in that situation. One is practical, one is more questionable.

  • [-]
  • aerin_sol
  • 6 Points
  • 23:40:09, 17 January

But... the bikini is worn in public.

I don't think the physical environment is really the context, as presumably the OP wouldn't have a problem with his girlfriend naked anywhere if no one is around/has the potential to be around. The context is the people, and if OP would be comfortable with his girlfriend wearing a bathing suit on the beach or by the pool in the presence of his roommate, there's frankly no real difference.

  • [-]
  • Gibonius
  • 4 Points
  • 01:48:27, 18 January

Nobody is going to look twice at somebody wearing a bikini on the beach. You're going to draw a lot of attention wearing a bikini walking down Main Street.

Context matters. "Public" is way too broad a term.

  • [-]
  • Honeeblood
  • 4 Points
  • 00:06:25, 18 January

I know, I still think there's a difference between expected situation and somewhat intimate private situation. Like, if a girl came round to my apartment and walked around in a bikini/her underwear I would be thoroughly uncomfortable. If she were to do this by a pool, I would be okay with it.

I'd be more comfortable seeing someone who's pretty much a stranger in their underwear by a pool than seeing them in a bikini in my house. But that's just me.

I do feel the physical context has a lot to do with it, social expectations and all. Presuming OP is okay with his roommate seeing her in a bikini (have not been back to this thread, so unaware) then it's entirely about locational context, as well as if she were by a pool everyone would be nearly naked and thus it's less weird.

  • [-]
  • BoomBoomLove
  • 2 Points
  • 05:30:30, 18 January

You are being shitty if your girlfriend feels you are being shitty.

I had a boyfriend who disliked that I wore shorts and a tank top around his roommate. Mind you it was 104* outside and I worked hard to look good in shorts and a tank top. I had no trouble with it, was not trying to hit on his roommate, and there was nothing sexual on my mind. I cannot help if men have sexual thoughts about me, I can only act in a way that seems acceptable to me.

It was not right for him to tell me to put on clothes when his roommate, and himself, were topless.

It is not fair for you to ask her to put on more clothes when you guys are in your form of underwear.

However, what you can do is purchase some nightgowns for her and hint that you think she looks amazing in them. Act very turned on by it and then ask her to wear them all the time when she is at your place. Even have some for her to wear. That way it turns into doing something nice for you and she is covered up.

  • [-]
  • 1x11x
  • 0 Points
  • 09:09:36, 18 January

No, you are being a pushover for not standing up for your own beliefs, instead you come here asking for permission if it's ok to be uncomfortable with your girlfriends actions.

Stand up for yourself, if she chooses to be inconsiderate of your feelings, it should tell you everything you need to know about her.

  • [-]
  • m1m
  • 0 Points
  • 23:25:18, 17 January

Yes you are old fashioned. That's not bad! But it means nothing as far as op and his gf are concerned. She's not wearing overtly sexual clothing in a place she considers a sort of second home or third home (so's place is a home base...).

  • [-]
  • alyra
  • 41 Points
  • 21:54:41, 17 January

So listen. You think you're asking only a small favor of her, and so she should just do it since it's important to you and minimal effort for her. But that's not how she sees it, and she isn't even really wrong. Because she feels so strongly about this (which you knew in advance, btw), your request is effectively for her to compromise her own values to make you more comfortable. It's not a small request; it's a huge request, and one you shouldn't make lightly.

Now that you understand this, maybe you can deal with the situation a bit more effectively?

  • [-]
  • amisexist_throwaway
  • -6 Points
  • 22:22:26, 17 January

She feels strongly about feminism and gender equality. My contention, at least I think, is that my hang-up isn't related to her gender. It's related to her being my SO. Possessive? Probably. Also, as I've said in other replies, I think the comparison between the aesthetic of boxers and tight boy shorts is incongruent.

Thanks for your reply, though.

  • [-]
  • alyra
  • 27 Points
  • 23:37:33, 17 January

> My contention, at least I think, is that my hang-up isn't related to her gender. It's related to her being my SO.

OK, I'd originally thought that you should've seen this coming, but now I've noticed that you've only been together for three months, so maybe that expectation was too harsh. Look, independent of this particular argument, maybe you ought to read up a little bit on feminism if you want this relationship to last? "The personal is the political" is pretty much the slogan of second-wave feminism (so it's been around awhile...), and the point of the slogan is that the stuff that happens within private relationships has a long, sordid history of being a tool used to keep women as a whole out of power.

  • [-]
  • Voiles
  • -9 Points
  • 22:49:53, 17 January

>your request is effectively for her to compromise her own values to make you more comfortable.

What values are these?

  • [-]
  • twentyfoursevensex
  • 21 Points
  • 23:04:50, 17 January

Equality.

  • [-]
  • Voiles
  • -6 Points
  • 23:19:13, 17 January

Please elaborate. OP doesn't walk around in his underwear in front of members of the opposite sex and expects the same of his GF. How is this not equal?

  • [-]
  • Nirvana_sucks
  • 13 Points
  • 23:47:32, 17 January

Because OP is not applying the same standards to his roommate as he is to his SO, seemingly because she is a female in addition to his SO. It would be interesting what the OP would think if his SO was a man.

  • [-]
  • Protege1027
  • -3 Points
  • 23:59:37, 17 January

Your response is ridiculous. Reread the OP, but remove any references to gender and just replace them with "my SO" and "my roommate" and you'll see that your response is silly.

This is not a gendered issue.

EDIT: OP is not saying "because you're a woman", he's saying "because you're my SO". His SO is the one gendering it, saying "it's only because I'm a woman!"

  • [-]
  • Voiles
  • -4 Points
  • 00:01:01, 18 January

His roommate is not wearing form-fitting underwear in their presence. As I said above, >I'm pretty sure if his roommate walked in wearing boy shorts or similarly revealing underwear, OP would be like, "Dude, leave something to the imagination!"

What's more, he's not dating his roommate.

  • [-]
  • the-friendzoner
  • 13 Points
  • 01:12:45, 18 January

> His roommate is not wearing form-fitting underwear in their presence. As I said above

ALL women's clothing tends to be form-fitting.

In fact, imo, boyshort are the equivalent of boxers. It's not like anything was showing, just her legs. Look at women's jeans and men's jeans and tell me that it's the same.

  • [-]
  • Voiles
  • -4 Points
  • 01:32:09, 18 January

>In fact, imo, boyshort are the equivalent of boxers.

Women can (and do) wear boxers, too. And with the prevalence of skinny jeans for both men and women, I'm not sure I agree with your second point, either.

If OP's roommate were walking around in his tighty-whities, I would say that this is also inappropriate, even though only his legs would be showing in this case, too.

  • [-]
  • the-friendzoner
  • 6 Points
  • 01:44:59, 18 January

>Women can (and do) wear boxers, too.

I'm not saying they don't, but do they use them as underwear or pyjamas. Because if it's pyjamas then that's irrelevant. Just that it's unrealistic to apply these tiny rules to everything. If it's okay to wear underwear in the house for the roomate, then it's okay. Lead by example.

Male skinny jeans are not the same either, anyway. And I'm talking about just general jeans, pants, shirts, everything. Women's clothes are almost as a rule form-fitting.

  • [-]
  • Voiles
  • -2 Points
  • 01:58:28, 18 January

> Because if it's pyjamas then that's irrelevant.

In the above situation, they had just woken up and were in their pajamas. So I think it is relevant.

>If it's okay to wear underwear in the house for the roommate, then it's okay.

I disagree; you're purposely ignoring how revealing different underwear is. As I said before: If OP's roommate were walking around in his tighty-whities, I would say that this is also inappropriate, even though only his legs would be showing in this case, too.

>Male skinny jeans are not the same either, anyway.

Why not? I think this very much applies.

>Women's clothes are almost as a rule form-fitting.

Why do you think this is?

  • [-]
  • midwestwatcher
  • 0 Points
  • 01:57:44, 18 January

OP can't legally control his roommate. If he is on the lease, the roommate does not have to obey OP (even though he has asked him before).

It's not fair to point to an outside party whose apartment it is to make the comparison.

  • [-]
  • wanderingimpromptu
  • 9 Points
  • 03:28:42, 18 January

OP can't legally control his girlfriend either. So it's not a legal issue in either case.

  • [-]
  • midwestwatcher
  • 1 Points
  • 03:32:09, 18 January

Of course he can't. But when making the comparison of a double-standard, it is unfair to point at someone who is not OP or who OP does not directly give instructions to.

My point is that if OP is wearing clothes, then there is no double standard. His request may be fair or unfair, sexist or not, but there is no double standard so long as OP keeps his clothes on. He said elsewhere he objected to his roommate; he can do no more than that.

  • [-]
  • alyra
  • 4 Points
  • 23:45:49, 17 January

I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain the basics of feminism to you right now, and I'm also not particularly comfortable trying to explain the nitty gritty details of the values for someone I only know from a few paragraphs written by someone else.

This is especially true given that your response to whatever I say is likely going to be to argue about why this particular set of values is wrong, and OP's girlfriend needs to just get over it. But it doesn't even matter if you think it's wrong and I think it's right, because it's her values system and relationship, and we're just a couple of internet strangers. The best either of us can do is give OP advice on how to work with it.

  • [-]
  • Voiles
  • -4 Points
  • 00:14:47, 18 January

Here's what I think the main tenet of feminism is: "Men and women should have equal rights and opportunities, socially, politically, and economically." Feel free to disagree or add anything--I don't claim to be an expert on feminism.

If OP were a woman and were uncomfortable with her BF walking around in his underwear in front of a female roommate, my response would be the same. I don't see where feminism plays a role in this situation and I am honestly asking which values of hers you were citing above.

  • [-]
  • alyra
  • 23 Points
  • 00:42:12, 18 January

There is a long history of men feeling possessive over women's bodies. This is far more of a "thing" than women feeling possessive over men's bodies, though obviously that can happen sometimes too. Taken to the extreme, you end up with a society where women have to wear a burqa to go outside. And I know--OP isn't taking this to that kind of an extreme.

According to western social norms, OP's request seems pretty reasonable on its face. I could easily imagine a woman making a similar request of her male partner. But that's not what's happening here. What's happening here is (to the feminist eye) a microcosm of male possessiveness over women's bodies. Furthermore, it is a request that she cater her behavior to the sensibilities of the ever-pervasive 'male gaze'. It's different than a woman making this request to a man because the historical context is different, and to OP's girlfriend, it probably sounds a lot like OP is asking her to just forget about all the things that she's passionately trying to change about the world in order to make it a better place.

So, yeah, whether she's being reasonable or not, it's still a big request.

  • [-]
  • Voiles
  • 2 Points
  • 00:54:35, 18 January

Okay, thanks for elaborating. I hadn't considered historical context.

I still don't really like this part, which is not to say that this is not the way that it is. >It's different than a woman making this request to a man because the historical context is different

It seems like you're saying (and correct me if I'm wrong), "If a woman asks her male SO not to walk around in his underwear, that's not a big request. But if a man makes the same request of his female SO, it is a big deal because of historical events." Which seems inherently unequal to me. If true equality is the goal, I would think that the sex of the individuals in this argument should be irrelevant.

  • [-]
  • alyra
  • 8 Points
  • 01:13:03, 18 January

> If true equality is the goal, I would think that the sex of the individuals in this argument should be irrelevant.

Well...maybe. But the thing is, I would bet that men make this kind of request a lot more often than women do, because we don't really live in a 100% equal society. So for any particular man making this request, it's kind-of hard to figure out what fraction of his discomfort arises from internalized sexism that he probably isn't even really aware of, and what fraction arises from "other".

  • [-]
  • Voiles
  • 2 Points
  • 01:42:36, 18 January

> it's kind-of hard to figure out what fraction of his discomfort arises from internalized sexism that he probably isn't even really aware of, and what fraction arises from "other".

Fair enough. But it seems like OP is practicing what he preaches: >I do hold myself to a similar standard, aside from occasionally being shirtless in the presence of my roommate. I always put on gym shorts or sweats.

  • [-]
  • midwestwatcher
  • -1 Points
  • 01:59:56, 18 January

That actually switches as you get older. Generally speaking anyway.

  • [-]
  • AnneNeville
  • 15 Points
  • 00:58:31, 18 January

I was with you about not wanting your girlfriend in just underpants around your roommate. But you lost me when you said your roommate being in boxers was somehow not the same.

If underwear in unacceptable on her, it's unacceptable on him.

  • [-]
  • springfall
  • 22 Points
  • 22:08:31, 17 January

Would she be just as comfortable with a female friend of hers walking around in underwear around you?

Not saying she is in the wrong but it does sound like she isn't really taking your feelings into account.

Also rather than bringing the topic up in front of your roommate she should have mentioned her argument about him in boxers to you privately rather than 'throwing you under the bus.'

  • [-]
  • Protege1027
  • 7 Points
  • 00:08:26, 18 January

Yeah, arguing in front of the room mate like that... complete lack of social acumen.

  • [-]
  • istara
  • 44 Points
  • 22:03:44, 17 January

I'll go against the grain here - I think you're overreacting and being horribly controlling and sexist.

What does it actually matter if your roommate - or anyone else - sees her in knickers?

She was "at home", the roommate was also wearing boxers, I think you need to get over the prudishness and just let be. If you don't trust her or the roommate, that's a whole other issue.

  • [-]
  • amisexist_throwaway
  • 8 Points
  • 22:18:05, 17 January

Thanks for your perspective.

  • [-]
  • hansSA
  • 17 Points
  • 22:34:58, 17 January

I agree 100%. I couldn't imagine being so insecure in a relationship that something like this would cause a problem. Seriously, grow up and stop trying to control other adults. Take it or leave it, don't be that guy.

  • [-]
  • amisexist_throwaway
  • 12 Points
  • 22:44:12, 17 January

Thanks for your reply. I think you're being a bit harsh, but I appreciate the sentiment nonetheless.

  • [-]
  • hansSA
  • -6 Points
  • 23:00:12, 17 January

Eh, probably a tad harsh but whatevs. You're entitled to plant your flag and fight whatever battles you want in a relationship, just personally, I can't see this battle ending well for your relationship and I can't imagine this being worth it.

  • [-]
  • Nirvana_sucks
  • 2 Points
  • 23:49:44, 17 January

Agreed. 3 months in, and this is a huge problem? Not looking so good.

  • [-]
  • Pominoz
  • 2 Points
  • 05:26:58, 18 January

Agree with this totally. I think you need to look at what your actual reasons for thinking it's inappropriate. Do you think she is trying to show off for your roommate? Are you concerned that your roommate will be aroused by her? Has he said that it makes him uncomfortable? Is it basically because you don't like someone else looking at your girlfriend?

That said, I do think there is a line. Going into the kitchen and making coffee in her underwear and heading back to the bedroom with it? All good. If I'm going to climb back into bed to drink my coffee, I'm not going to get dressed properly.

But, making breakfast, hanging out, watching some shitty morning telly for an hour or so in a communal area? It makes sense to put some pants on, and I would expect the same from a roommate as well, lest we all catch a glimpse of the sneaky peen.

  • [-]
  • dr-million
  • 1 Points
  • 09:00:41, 18 January

> I think you're overreacting and being horribly controlling and sexist.

> She was "at home", the roommate was also wearing boxers, I think you need to get over the prudishness and just let be

Seriously?

Why does it always have to be one extreme or the other on this sub? Why do people always feel the need to set boundaries for others? She's not being entirely unreasonable because, if OP doesn't have a problem with his roommate being in boxers around her, he is definitely being a hypocrite. But he's also not being entirely unreasonable in asking her to put on a pair of shorts, since its hardly an unusual request for someone to ask that their S.O. (male or female) not be half naked in the presence of their friends or roommates. Some people attach a certain level of intimacy to that image and feel it should remain in the bedroom. You can call it prudish or whatever you'd like, but it isn't your place to anybody to get over it if they aren't comfortable doing so. If he was DEMANDING she not wear any revealing clothing (skirts, low-cut shirts, etc.) EVER, this would be pretty black and white and we could all call OP a dipshit and tell him he needs to change. But that's hardly the case here.

There's no easy solution here and ultimately, they may just be incompatible. If they want to stay together there'll have to be some compromise, but neither one should feel like they have to change if it makes them uncomfortable.

  • [-]
  • Protege1027
  • -1 Points
  • 00:10:57, 18 January

>I'll go against the grain here - I think you're overreacting and being horribly controlling and sexist.

How is he being sexist? OP didn't make it a gendered issue - she did.

  • [-]
  • AnneNeville
  • 29 Points
  • 01:04:38, 18 January

She didn't make it a gendered issue by asking if OP's standards were the same for his roommate. OP made it a gendered issue by having different standards for her and for the guy he lives with.

  • [-]
  • Protege1027
  • -4 Points
  • 01:12:43, 18 January

OP has different standards for his significant other and his room mate.

Also here:

>I tell her that 1) His boxers aren't form-fitting, aside from seeing some leg, there's still plenty left to the imagination. 2) He isn't my partner.

>She then objected to the whole situation as an example of gender inequality.

She made it a gendered issue. You're welcome, have a nice day!

  • [-]
  • Incomprehensibilitea
  • 8 Points
  • 01:08:49, 18 January

Roomate is allowed to wear his underpants because he is a man and the OP doesn't find him arousing, girlfriend isn't allowed to wear her underpants because when she does it, it's way too sexy and inappropriate. Moral of the story: Mens bodies are acceptable to be viewed by the world, womens are sexual and inappropriate to be in public. It ties in to how men and womens bodies are viewed differently. Think of in movies, tv, and real life you see dudes in their boxers all the bloody time, playing videogames, lounging around, etc, you don't see women doing that because somehow our bodies are more titillating than mens and must be hidden.

  • [-]
  • TheMidnightMeatTrain
  • 4 Points
  • 01:26:26, 18 January

OP has already stated he's told his roommate several times before to wear pants/shorts.

  • [-]
  • Incomprehensibilitea
  • 9 Points
  • 01:38:16, 18 January

I haven't read those comments. In that case, I see no problem. When his girlfriend says, "Why can't I wear my underwear when your roommate does?" He should say, "I would prefer it if he didn't either, but unfortunately my feelings don't matter as much to him as they should to you." If she still has a problem, it's her problem not his.

  • [-]
  • Protege1027
  • 2 Points
  • 01:11:27, 18 January

You're reading way too deep and adding stuff that isn't even there. OP himself has stated "it's not because she's a woman, it's because she's my SO."

  • [-]
  • Incomprehensibilitea
  • 1 Points
  • 01:14:58, 18 January

So, if another woman came over to his house, he would be completely comfortable with her wearing her underwear?

  • [-]
  • Protege1027
  • 6 Points
  • 01:16:41, 18 January

Ask him instead of making tons of assumptions.

  • [-]
  • amisexist_throwaway
  • 0 Points
  • 04:57:11, 18 January

That's just not a tenable assertion. I can practically guarantee that a woman would not just waltz into my apartment in her underwear.

  • [-]
  • mmmmmpopplers
  • 8 Points
  • 22:19:06, 17 January

I am a strong liberal feminist and I'm kinda with you here, but that's mainly b/c I would not be comfortable being in my underwear in front of an SOs roommate. I think that bathing suits are different personally. Really though, if she is comfortable wearing just panties in front of your roommate, it might be easier to talk to your roommate and ask him not to oogle her.

  • [-]
  • catalicious
  • 10 Points
  • 22:35:27, 17 January

I can understand your discomfort, but your roomie walking around in boxers is pretty much the same thing. Making the argument that his boxers aren't "form-fitting" and THAT's why they're okay to wear is sexist. Her wearing lady boxers should be the same as him wearing dude boxers. Boxers in public are generally not thought of as items to wear around roommates, and that's fine if you don't feel uncomfortable. But you don't need to sexualize normal female body parts.

  • [-]
  • newfarmgirl
  • 8 Points
  • 23:05:32, 17 January

But he didn't say "lady boxers." He said "boy short panties that make her ass look nice." Now idk about you, but my panties that fit that description are skin tight and cut halfway up my cheeks. There's a BIG difference between those and boxers!

  • [-]
  • Baggel
  • 2 Points
  • 06:59:17, 18 January

I think /u/catalicious meant the female equivalent to boxers which, yes, are tighter, but female clothing is in general.

  • [-]
  • Protege1027
  • -2 Points
  • 00:14:02, 18 January

> I can understand your discomfort, but your roomie walking around in boxers is pretty much the same thing.

It's not. He's not dating him and he lives there while she is a guest. Not the same thing by a long shot.

>Making the argument that his boxers aren't "form-fitting" and THAT's why they're okay to wear is sexist.

No it's not. Women can wear boxers, too.

>But you don't need to sexualize normal female body parts.

lolwut. "You don't need to sexualize the sexual parts of the female body."

What's an "abnormal" female body part, BTW?

  • [-]
  • Vandredd
  • 2 Points
  • 05:12:08, 18 January

> I anticipated this and mostly just said I'm sorry,

This is where this mistake happened. If she can't respect your boundaries she can't respect you

  • [-]
  • Danianne
  • 6 Points
  • 23:00:11, 17 January

What is it you're worried about? Your roommate looking at her? He'll probably look at her anyway, even in your shorts. And even so, that's HIS problem, not hers.

She shouldn't have to change her comfort clothes in the home (yours or hers) because of how your roommate might react to them. Has he ever acted inappropriately around her? If so, bring that up with him, not her.

If it's just about you being possessive and you're not really worried about anything in particular.. try to be proud of her nice ass rather than secretive of it?

I find boy shorts much more comfortable than mens boxer shorts. The form fitting reduces irritation from loose material and such. I can see why she wants to wear them for comfort. Plus, she probably wears much more revealing stuff at the beach or swimming pool and no doubt you'll have to deal with that one day too.

As for gender equality.. yeah, it is pretty unequal that women in underwear is somehow so different to men in underwear. However, even if this is the case, knowing this wont stop you being upset about it. We were all brought up this way. What will stop you being upset about it (and I think you should stop being upset about it rather than asking her to change) is actively trying to see it in a different light.

I personally wouldn't wear such clothes infront of my SOs brothers (who he lives with) and actively ask him to put on a layer when he's in my home since I live with my mother.. but your SO might be much more comfortable with that kind of thing, and there's nothing wrong with that. Coming to terms with it might be a good experience for you? Besides, if you ask her to cover up, you pretty much will have to ask him too.. You say the difference is that she's your SO and he's your roommate, rather than she's a woman and he's not. Thinking along that vein, shouldn't you be more concerned with what your SO wants than your roommate? And she wants to wear her boyshorts. By your logic, you should be more willing to accept what she finds comfortable, because she's your SO and that should be important to you?

I am sort of on your SO's side of this, but I hope you feel better about it too. I think you could. I don't think you're actively sexist, just perhaps need to view things a different way.

  • [-]
  • Protege1027
  • 8 Points
  • 00:06:47, 18 January

OP, she's behaving in a way that makes you uncomfortable around other men, and that's not cool - period. She's not respecting your boundaries, and she's trying to justify it with "gender equality". She's basically bringing her politics into the relationship and gendering issues that aren't about gender, but about comfort zones and boundaries.

In the end - there is no "gender equality" in dating. You are not an equal opportunity employer - you have the right to reject anyone you want if they don't respect you. And you have the right to any boundaries you want.

You're saying "I feel like you're disrespecting me as a partner" and she's saying "I feel like you're disrespecting me as a woman." This is a major incompatibility. And this is an argument that you will never win with her because she has a chip on her shoulder. Just a heads up.

(And yeah - your room mate is a much different relation than someone you're dating, so no, all things "are not equal" in that equation. Also as another poster pointed out - he's at home. She's a guest.)

  • [-]
  • midwestwatcher
  • -3 Points
  • 02:03:57, 18 January

This is a great post and I wish it were higher up. There is a fundamental difference in the way each is trying to express themselves, and almost seems like the way the girlfriend chose to express herself is less about "How I feel" and more "How I ought to feel."

  • [-]
  • Andhareall
  • 6 Points
  • 01:37:57, 18 January

Jesus fuck. Some of these answers honestly have me shaking my head.

Yes, gender equality is important and I understand that if men can do it, women should be able to do it too. BUT, I find it disrespectful that she would walk around in her underwear when there is another male in the house. That is intimate wear to be seen only by you. I, for one, would never want my bf to walk around in his underwear in front of my girl friends because I don't want them fantasizing about him or sexualizing him unnecessarily, whether it's harmless or not, just as I would not walk around in my underwear in front if his roommate or friends.

The whole argument about underwear and bathing suits and yadda yadda is ridiculous. When you go out with a group of people or have them over to hang at your house, you're wearing clothes. If you go to the beach, you're wearing swimwear. It all depends on the activity the group is taking part in.

As far as the roommate thing, he lives there. If he wants to walk around in HIS place of residence and be comfortable, then he has every prerogative to do so. But, I would ask him to keep some pants on when she's at your house out of respect for y'alls relationship. Many a time have I seen a wayward testicle or penis tip poking out from one's boxers because of how loose they are.

  • [-]
  • elf-rifle
  • 2 Points
  • 05:22:08, 18 January

I'd like to hear what her rationale would be if you caught her sleeping with your roommate. Is it still gender inequality?

And did you tell her what your roommate will probably do with the visuals whenever he goes to sleep at night when he's alone???

  • [-]
  • ViolentEastCoastCity
  • 1 Points
  • 21:55:05, 17 January

You're within your rights to tell your girlfriend that you aren't comfortable with her wearing what you perceive to be revealing clothing in front of other people. The roommate's attire is irrelevant; he isn't your girlfriend.

Both sides of a good relationship will make compromises; she should have respected your opinions and changed into something else. Decide if this is a dealbreaker; can you compromise where she won't?

If you think you can manage, then let it go. If you can't manage, then talk with her; say that the lack of respect was a bit much. If you aren't constantly bending her for things to go your way, tell her you're breaking up. You pretty much have to if you can't deal with it. She'll give in to preserve the relationship.

Keep in mind there will get to a point where too many compromises will break the camels back. At that point you're always fighting; that's already not a good relationship.

  • [-]
  • RadRobot13
  • 2 Points
  • 03:54:09, 18 January

your dating one of the hipster feminists. . not the real ones. You are in for a bad time.

  • [-]
  • throwaw188
  • 1 Points
  • 05:22:24, 18 January

You know what's a term this sub loves to throw around all the time? Gaslighting. That's exactly what she's doing to you. You voiced a concern, and rather than address it, she makes you question if you are sexist. This situation is pretty fucked up.

Honestly, I'd dump her and never date a militant feminist again.

  • [-]
  • Voiles
  • 2 Points
  • 23:01:45, 17 January

I think her bringing your roommate's attire into this argument is a false equivalence--you're not dating him. Here's a true counterpoint: suppose the roles were reversed and you were at her place, walking around in your underwear in front of her female roommate. Would she be okay with this?

  • [-]
  • Jamba_your_Juice
  • 0 Points
  • 01:30:13, 18 January

How about a rule that everyone wear pants over underwear when out of the bedroom? Including your roommate when your gf is there. I think it's more about respecting everybody. I would feel really uncomfortable if my bf's roommate was walking around in underwear and did she ever think she's making him uncomfortable as she did you? It's great to be confident but everyone walking around in their underwear is just asking for trouble, in my opinion.

  • [-]
  • stolenbypirates
  • 0 Points
  • 04:18:12, 18 January

Tell her you're perfectly fine with her wearing boxers around your roommate, and that you'd be just as uncomfortable if your roommate wandered around in boyshorts.

Or, just let it go. It's more cover than a bikini, after all.

You might want to have a separate discussion at another time about adjustments people make in relationships, and give and take. Calling it gender inequality is over-the-top to this staunch feminist.

  • [-]
  • amisexist_throwaway
  • 1 Points
  • 04:54:27, 18 January

Hey everyone thanks for your responses. I appreciate that there's a diversity of opinion and that I can suss valid points from many posts.

Ultimately, I don't think it will be a big deal between us. but it is important to represent our feelings and make adjustments for each other.

  • [-]
  • elf-rifle
  • -2 Points
  • 05:34:46, 18 January

Maybe it's one of those shit tests you hear about. Just let her do whatever and say nothing. She'll quit when there's no provocation.

  • [-]
  • DrNotEscalator
  • 0 Points
  • 05:41:16, 18 January

Personally I think she's being ridiculous. IMO you cover up when you're around people who aren't supposed to see you practically naked, i.e. not your partner. Also, I'm a woman and people who are this militantly feminist and make everything a "feminist issue" annoy me. Honestly expect this to come up whenever she wants to get her way.

  • [-]
  • 9to5_Caffeinated
  • 0 Points
  • 07:02:32, 18 January

Oh ffs. Is she the only one who's not allowed to have her comfort compromised?

You both have discomfort in this situation. You with the boy-short underwear; her with being politely asked to wear something less revealing. But do you see who's comfort gets compromised? Yours.

You might want to point this out to her.

Relationships are about compromise. There will always be disagreements; or different points of views between couples.....if you two are considering some kind of long-term or permanent relationship you both need to learn to compromise.

Tell her to put her pride aside and compromise on the fricken underwear. Its just underwear.

Edit: This is coming from a female that's been married for nearly 2 decades; and I would kind of call myself a feminist. Just not the burning bra's type feminist.

  • [-]
  • lolwut_noway
  • 1 Points
  • 07:31:57, 18 January

what the fuck am i doing with my life

  • [-]
  • PrettyLittleBird
  • 1 Points
  • 07:49:50, 18 January

I would be really annoyed if I walked in on my roommate with any of their friends/guests/significant others in their underwear. I would definitely feel like I couldn't be in the common areas or like I was infringing on their space even in my own house. Maybe politely tell her that others might be uncomfortable and might not want to see her in her underwear in their public spaces?

  • [-]
  • dixons-vixen
  • 1 Points
  • 08:01:49, 18 January

Although I can see where you're coming from OP, if I was in your gfs situation I'd probably be a little annoyed too. You say she is a feminist so maybe she feels a little "oppressed" by being pressured to wear more clothes whereas your roommate is allowed to walk around in boxers. Maybe she feels like that is an unfair thing to ask of her since she is a faithful, loyal woman as is your roommate (I apologise for making assumptions). But if it means a lot to you that your roommate doesnt see your gf in her boy shorts then I think she could make a compromise :)

  • [-]
  • extremerohit
  • 1 Points
  • 08:57:56, 18 January

Shiiit you sound exactly like me but i was in the opposite scenario with my gf. She said she wishes she could just walk out without having to put on a bra or shirt and im tell her do it if you want. My roommate has walked out in just a towel, and also just boxer briefs. And we're all okay with this.

Eventually she did get comfortable being in the living room with just a bra. But i guess that involves being completely comfortable with each other and secure that no lustful eyes will wander

  • [-]
  • 1x11x
  • 1 Points
  • 09:05:12, 18 January

>vocal feminist

You should expect to deal with shit like this dating a "vocal feminist", you got what you asked for, my advice is to either learn to live with her lack of consideration or break up and find a sane girl.

  • [-]
  • sachalamp
  • 1 Points
  • 09:28:29, 18 January

Is this your apartment only? For how long are you in there with your roommate? How often does he do that? How often have you mentioned it to him and how? How did he take it? Why doesn't he comply?

Did your girlfriend see him like that in other occasions? Because if so, she might have registered that the house rules are relaxed and it's appropriate. But that doesn't warrant her to disconsider your feelings, even though they come out in a rather confusing way. It's your feelings and they need to be discussed. Yet she shames you. She demands her comfort, yet is ignores yours. This is a red flag.

Your roommate is the first issue to be addressed, if you're uncomfortable with no pants rule. You should enforce it no matter who's doing it. Were you more firm about your needs in the beginning, a lot could have been avoided. (Your roommate seems off a bit though. I would not just walk around in shorts around my roommates gf, especially since it's just 3 months)

Also, what top was your gf wearing? If it was something tight and her whole shebang was revealed, that's not so cool. A shirt or a larger tshirt would have made it more acceptable.

Last but not least, this could have been some test of how secure are you. Which was failed.

Also, if you want to get your point across, do it directly. "Ass looks good but.." is kind of manipulative.

  • [-]
  • midwestwatcher
  • 0 Points
  • 01:43:48, 18 January

I agree with what others have said (everyone should be clothed in the common living space if it makes some of you uncomfortable), but I also want to point out it's a bit funny your girlfriend can point out your slight sexism without noticing that her garments and their designers are arguably more sexist. Women's clothing and bathing suits have long been designed by men and as a direct result has always been skimpier than men's underwear. It might be an interesting discussion point to bring up to her.

I also have to say, I don't think you are setting a double standard. So long as YOU aren't going around only in underwear, your girlfriend wasn't being fully fair to point at your roommate who you cannot legally control. If he is on the lease, he can legally walk around in his underwear in front of anyone who chooses to come in. You can and should voice your objections to him, but you cannot force him to obey you, which is why your girlfriend was out of bounds pointing at him as an example (again, assuming YOU were clothed).

My bigger concern is for you. Your girlfriend brings up some good points and has every right to be a vocal feminist and consider the gender implications of every situation. However, is it possible she is putting her philosophy ahead of your relationship? If she is going to object to something like "please wear clothes around my roommate", I wonder if she takes your feelings seriously in general. At the very least, it sounds like she is making a bigger deal out of it than it ought to have been, as she should have had that conversation with you in private and not made a scene when your roommate walked down.

  • [-]
  • TucoShakur
  • 2 Points
  • 04:22:28, 18 January

Fuck it. I read a bit of the replies and I just don't even care anymore. Let everyone wear whatever they want, let their bits hang out where ever, dudes and girls, good looking and not so much. This is just too stupid.

  • [-]
  • Blue_Collar
  • 0 Points
  • 04:37:55, 18 January

The reason is simple and easy to articulate. Tell her you know your roommate will jerk off to the image of her in her underwear later and that bothers you but you feel confident that she won't flick her bean to the image of him in his boxers.

  • [-]
  • iamslm22
  • 0 Points
  • 01:10:07, 18 January

Personally I'm 100% on your side. I don't think it's hypocritical to ask things of your gf and not of your roommate. I think she be wearing more than just underwear, but that's just me.

  • [-]
  • uteuxpia
  • -2 Points
  • 02:58:55, 18 January

Your GF is a damn fool. Here's why:

She's equating her wearing "bootilicious" shorts, and equating that to your roommate wearing boxers on the merits that they're both underwear.

Does she think that all panty girls want to fuck all boxer-short-wearing boys as hard or as much as all boxer-short-wearing boys want to fuck all panty wearing girls?

  • [-]
  • [deleted]
  • -10 Points
  • 23:00:50, 17 January

[deleted]

  • [-]
  • [deleted]
  • -3 Points
  • 00:28:15, 18 January

[deleted]

  • [-]
  • Smokeahontas
  • -3 Points
  • 23:39:23, 17 January

Would you feel the same discomfort if she was wearing a bathing suit at the beach or pool surrounded by strangers?

  • [-]
  • sonnnnny
  • -1 Points
  • 22:13:05, 17 January

I'll try spin this in a different direction. What if you were at her place in your boxers and then her female roomate was in the room with the same knickers? Then what would your reaction be?

  • [-]
  • amisexist_throwaway
  • 14 Points
  • 22:19:09, 17 January

I wouldn't be in my boxers. I would be at least wearing gym shorts.